Pillow Prince Unplugged: Pegging, Power, and Performance

From the flashing lights of Making the Band to the intimate corners of reinvention, Pillow Prince (Jared Garner) has lived many lives: go-go dancer, reality TV star, queer artist, and now the voice behind the new album Slept On.

In this episode, Pillow opens up about:

✨ His experience on being scouted for Netflix’s Making the Band

✨ The shedding of old skins — from Jared to Pillow Prince

✨ The tension between performance, pleasure, and power (yes, we talk about top and bottom energy and even pegging)

✨ Why Mariah Carey and Beyoncé continue to shape his artistry

✨ What he wants you to feel when you press play on Slept On

Follow Pillow Prince on Instagram @pillowprinceee and stream Slept On now on Spotify and Apple Music.

Transcript

Quincy: 0:00

Everybody welcome to Cocoon After Dark where the Velvet curtain falls and real stories breathe. Tonight we invite Jared Gardner, better known as Pillow, a voice that first caught the world's ear on making the band once a go-Go dancer, always a dreamer. Pillow has lived many lives. Midwest Kid Reality tv, college seeker, queer artist, and now the Man Behind the new album Slept On. This is a conversation about reinvention, resilience, and the true sweet whisper to ourselves in the dark. Thanks for coming on.

Pillow: 0:36

Hi. Thank you for having me. I'm so excited to get to talk to you.

Quincy: 0:41

I'm so excited to talk to you too. And I love your shirt, so this is not going on TV yet, but when it will tell us all about your shirt.'cause you guys, this is gorgeous shirt.

Pillow: 0:50

Yeah, so I actually wore this shirt. Thank you so much for liking it. I, it's one of my favorites. I love a statement piece. I got this shirt probably like a year ago. I wore it. So I performed at a ball in New York City in Brooklyn. So they host this ball called, or this bar called$3 Bill Hosts balls every Monday. And so I wanted to just wear something very regal and like with the bows and the like, Fluffy shoulders and stuff. So I picked this. So this is one of my favorite pieces. So I thought it would be fitting for this'cause it gives pillows soft,

Quincy: 1:22

yes. Who made it? Who's the designer?

Pillow: 1:25

It's actually from a website called Akira. So they make a lot, I don't know if they make male clothes, but they make mostly female clothes. And honestly, a lot of my pieces that I find are often like, made for women, but I just get them in a size that like, fits me. I like playing with a lot of like unisex stuff. So it's one of my favorite shops because they make really like. Kind of out there like fashionable clothing, that's a little different. And so I saw this and immediately knew it would be perfect because you can tell, but it shows the body too.

Quincy: 1:53

Totally. Totally.

Pillow: 1:55

is really fun.

Quincy: 1:56

I love it. Yes. And you guys, just so you know, if you don't know who pillow is, he has an amazing body. So go on his Instagram pillow print and you'll be able to see what he's talking about when he says it shows the body

Pillow: 2:08

It does like the, no, it does, it, I always like a little like sexy, sultry moment tied in with a soft feminine moment. That's like my favorite thing to do.

Quincy: 2:17

Nice. That is so fun. So we're gonna start with a couple of warmups and just so people can get to know you, and sometimes we kinda spin off on some of those questions so it makes it really fun. But I love to ask the question, if you could speak three more languages fluently, assuming that we both speak fluent English, what would they be?

Pillow: 2:39

If I could speak three languages that I don't, or, so I only know English and a little bit of Spanish I would say the first one would be Spanish fluently because I've learned Spanish before, but I've forgotten a lot of. It would be really nice to be fluent in something I've already started. And I love the Spanish culture. I love just like I, I've loved learning Spanish and so I'd probably pick Spanish and I have a lot of friends too that speak Spanish. And in New York City too, there's so many Spanish speakers. I think it'd be nice to communicate with a lot of people that I often can't. So I would pick Spanish and then I would probably pick, what would be a good one? I would probably pick Italian because there's a lot of hot Italian people. I think that would be a really good language to flirt with people.

Quincy: 3:26

Right.

Pillow: 3:27

and then lastly, ugh. Honestly Korean because I really, I know'cause I think K-Pop is super dope. Like I've been trying to get more into it and I think something that would help would be if I could understand it better. So I think Korean would be really cool just to get to listen and understand that music. Or just when it comes to just anything like entertainment wise like that. I think Korean would be pretty dope. So those would be my three.

Quincy: 3:53

Awesome. Do you go out for Korean food, be beam bop or hot

Pillow: 3:56

No. Okay. No, not really. I'm so they do, I honestly just went on a date with my boyfriend in Korea town. And there are some like cool restaurants that I definitely had, but I don't go, like I should definitely go out there more.'cause in New York City there's like everything. So I wish, honestly maybe I should do that after this. But I would definitely learn Korean.'Cause I think that would be

Quincy: 4:14

Very cool. Okay, next thing. These are one word answers, so biggest turn off.

Pillow: 4:22

Biggest turnoff? I would say dirtiness. If they're dirty, I don't like that. You can be Like dirty in a sexy way, but if you're like messy, I don't really like that. If you just are not put together just like I just think don't have good hygiene. That's a huge

Quincy: 4:36

I agree. I agree. Biggest kink

Pillow: 4:41

Biggest kink. Oh my God, am I gonna expose myself? Okay. I would say I like nipple play. That's probably my favorite thing. That's my little secret

Quincy: 4:49

to receive or to give or both.

Pillow: 4:51

to receive. That's probably my favorite thing.

Quincy: 4:54

Nice,

Pillow: 4:54

the whole world that, yeah. Tease. I love that. Also when I wear like my outfits, like I love, like chest day is like my favorite day, like on a man I love like pectoral. So I would probably say anything that's like chest, like arousal, that's probably my favorite thing for sure. Oh,

Quincy: 5:12

So when you are at the gym and you see a guy with like really hot nipples, what do you do?

Pillow: 5:17

I think I might, I work out at a Planet Fitness. I think there's like a shirt. I think there's a shirt on policy there. So I don't typically see people's, yeah, I don't.'Cause you're in LA right?

Quincy: 5:28

Yeah, I'm in

Pillow: 5:28

In la. I don't, so in New York people don't really work out with their shirt off. Like I never see that at the gym. Like rare, like in the locker room I guess. But like on the actual gym, I don't ever see anyone shirtless. But I will say if I think something that's so hot is someone with like big arms in a really nice like chest. So that's probably what I would look at first on a man if I was just like at the gym. So yeah,

Quincy: 5:53

Yeah,

Pillow: 5:54

I love it. I don't know, like a titty moment. Like I love that. Like it, it's probably my favorite thing.

Quincy: 5:59

that is so funny. Worst habit.

Pillow: 6:03

Worst habit. I've been really hard on myself recently when it comes to, I think I get distracted very easily. So like I'll wake up one day deciding to do something and then I'll end up doing something totally different'cause my brain just wanders. So that's probably what I would

Quincy: 6:21

I hear you. If you could spend 48 hours with anyone living or dead, who would it be? Nice.

Pillow: 6:29

I would try to become best friends with her, like in four. Give me, you said 40 hours? Yeah, 40. We have a lot to cover. I would, I think, no, it would 100% be Beyonce because I would just love to, I would just love to ask her about her process. I'd love, I'd probably spend four hours telling her like. How much her art means to me and how much she's inspired me. But it would 100% be Beyonce.'cause I'm so curious as to I dunno, her artistic journey, like what inspires her? Like how she has such a great work ethic. I think 100% it would be Beyonce.

Quincy: 7:01

Did you see her on the Reformation

Pillow: 7:03

So I didn't see her for the like formation to her, but I saw her, I've seen her T twice. I went to her on the run part two tour with Jay-Z. So they did a tour together I don't know, like six years ago I went to that and then I went to her Renaissance tour. I went to the first one. So I did not go to Cowboy Carter'cause I was broke at the time. So I've basically seen her twice.

Quincy: 7:26

Okay, good. Very good. Everyone has to see her at least once in their life. It has to be on your but bucket list, right? So in doing some research for you, we're gonna get down to business. You said that Mariah Carey is one of your inspirations. So since we're already talking about concerts, how many times have you seen Mariah in concert? And then talk about what you, what inspires you from

Pillow: 7:49

so I actually saw Mariah Carey for the first time this past Christmas. I have never seen her before. In person. My boyfriend surprised me. He got his tickets to go see her for the, her Christmas show

Quincy: 8:02

Oh my gosh. How?

Pillow: 8:04

love her. Like she, she is somebody that's what's the hardest thing is when people ask me like, who's your favorite singer, favorite artist? Because I would say it's Mariah Carey and Beyonce. They both have just like certain things about them that I just really resonate with and just that, that have inspired me. So I would say those are probably like my two, biggest like inspirations. Doja cat is too, but, so I would say that's like the Holy Trinity Doja cat's the third. But where was I going with that? Yeah, I saw her for the first time for her Christmas concert, like last Christmas. And it was so good. She's such a diva. Like literally I have a picture on my wall of her. She, I'm like obsessed with her. And you asked me like, what is something that inspires me about her? I think definitely her songwriting, I've listened to a lot of her music and I just love that she writes the majority of her stuff and you can just tell just in the melodies and in the lyrics. Like she, she just has such a great foundation of what she wants to say. And then obviously it's paired with her incredible voice, so it's just I don't know, I think she just writes some of the best music and then also. I've read her book her, one of the few books I've read since graduating college. I literally have it. But I,

Quincy: 9:12

There's time for your reading later.

Pillow: 9:13

Yeah, no, literally. But that's the thing is so I just, I really love her journey and just, I remember when she, I read her book it's been a while, but she has one song called ah, fuck Oh make It Happen. And it's just like about basically you like making your dreams happen, like Cut. And she talks about in the book like how she lived in the city and how she was hustling and how she didn't have a lot of money and stuff like that. And that song is just such a huge motivator for me. So I feel like I just really like her as an artist because I think she came from a humble background and she really grew up and did her thing and made the career that she has and she's just always inspired me. So that's probably why I would say I

Quincy: 9:50

so awesome. So Jared, AKA pillow was on making the band. If you guys have not seen it, it's on Netflix. It's still streaming on there. And that's where we discovered him, me and my daughter we're sitting there watching, and by the end of the show, not the end of the show, but the end of the rehearsals or what do you call it, where you guys were like

Pillow: 10:12

Like the like the audition period, like the

Quincy: 10:14

audition part of it. Yeah. He never made it out onto stage. And my little daughter and I look at each other and we're like what happened to pillow? Because they would keep, like doing little scenes with him. And in fact, we watched the first episode again last night just so I could be fresh on what really happened in the first episode. And I was like, damn it. Why didn't they choose you and what song did you

Pillow: 10:34

so I, so I think that's a lot. So that's the same thing a lot of my friends and family were like, where were you? Because I'm in the first four epi episode. If you watch it, I'm in the first four episodes. So I was there for a second. I, overall what happened was like. I auditioned for it. I auditioned for it like months and months prior, before actually going on the, like you had to audition to be on the show. And then once I was on the show basically, I was there for a couple weeks and I did perform, everything was like filmed so there's somewhere, a vault somewhere that has my performance. Like I ate, like I danced and it was really cute. Like I I sing a J-Lo song. I got to sing. It was waiting for tonight. We didn't get to, so I didn't get to pick what's, I think that's also a huge misconception is that like a lot of us, like we didn't pick what song we got to sing, but they changed. They, I was told to sing waiting for tonight. And honestly, I like, at first, I was like, okay, like I know the song like everyone knows waiting for tonight, but I was like. Okay, interesting choice. But the thing for me that I really liked about the song is I feel like it really ties in, like with that whole moment this is my moment. Like I'm waiting for tonight. I'm excited to take my chance and be sexy and come out and show like what I got. And I just thought it was like, the rendition I did of it was really gorgeous. It was very like sexy. And it, I think it was honestly a really good pick for just who I am and like my brand and stuff. So I really enjoyed performing it, but they just didn't show it unfortunately, which I had no control over. But I still think minus all that, like not getting to show it, the experience was such a blessing to me and I learned so much and I'm sure we'll get into that, but yeah, it, it was waiting for tonight and I performed. It just didn't get shown unfortunately.

Quincy: 12:22

So when they contacted you, I believe you said they found you through Instagram,

Pillow: 12:26

I post a lot on my Instagram at pillow prints with three E's at the end. And I post on TikTok too. And so I post a lot of my performance videos, a lot of my music stuff like that. I post on that, those accounts. And so it's very I post a lot. So I, which I think someone from casting saw it and thought that I would be a good fit for the show because my brand is I wanna be a pop star. Like I want, I wanna take over the music scene. And so I think that must have resonated with someone from the casting. So they reached out to me and I auditioned for it. Yeah,

Quincy: 12:59

is so cool. So when you guys were in those like little booth thingies, w could you hear like other people talking or were they like soundproof?

Pillow: 13:08

So there's, I'm not supposed to talk about specifically like exactly like how certain things like happened but pretty much yeah, like I like being in those sound booths was a time where like you could listen to people's like audition and it shows that on the show, like you you get to listen to people like as they're singing. And you just have to make your decision like in the moment to pick. And so that was like the nerve wracking part is like you only get to pick so many. And so you have to just, I guess that's the crazy part about it, is like you could also pick people who don't pick you back or you could also, pick people that do pick you back. Like it was such like a, there, like there I had to basically give up full control. Like you had no control in any of that, so it definitely, like, how they show it on the show is very much like what happened. Hit the button for who you like and then you just hope that you can pick people who like resonate with your voice and like what you have to offer.

Quincy: 14:03

Are you allowed to tell us who you

Pillow: 14:05

So that's what's interesting is I'm trying to remember. So if you re think about it like, it happened like a year ago or like a year and a half ago, I will say this. I remember when I went on there, to be honest, like a huge thing for me is I wanted like a boy band or I wanted like a mixed boy and girl band. My goal, honestly was to find like a gay boy band or like a queer band. And I did a lot of like I did confessionals and shit and stuff. They just didn't really like the, in the final edit. There's only, there's so many contestants. I think that's a huge thing to remember is there's so many people, there's 50 of us, so they can't show everybody's moments and everybody's stuff. And I think they gave me such a beautiful edit'cause they showed my personality, like they showed enough of me to resonate with people. But I definitely in my confessionals, spoke more about what I was looking for, like who I wanted, like why I was here. And so like I really wanted I wanted a gay band. Like it didn't have to be gay, but a gay or queer band. But obviously when you're listening to people sing, you can't tell if they're gay. Like you can't even tell, like some of them even on the show, like you see, people can't even tell if it's a boy or a girl. Like you can't even tell if they're gay or not because like you say, oh, hi, my name's this. And then you just go into it. But some names aren't like gender specific. So and some people sing hi, some people sing and so it's very difficult. Like I didn't get to talk to anyone and be like, are you cool? So that never. That never really happened. And so I just think it was one of those things where it was like, I'm just gonna pick the people who I know I picked some people who like had really there's a girl on there named Elise. She's, I forget what she sang, but she made it through she made it pretty far. She made it into one of the

Quincy: 15:44

Yeah, she

Pillow: 15:44

I remember I heard her sing she's saying she sounded like she like hit some whistle notes, like it was given like Ariana Grande. I like hit that button so fast for her because her voice was just like, outta this world. It was crazy. And I was like, I would love to sing with someone like that. So I just picked voices that impressed me, or I thought my voice would go well with. I think the hard part too, though, is you only get so many, I don't remember the exact like number or anything like that, but you can only, you can't hit it for everybody. Like you can't, so you have to make sure, like you're hitting it for who you like resonate with. And once you run out, you can't keep hitting it. So it was one of those things where it was such a hard choice because everybody was good. Literally everybody sounded good. Like even the people. That they show, getting eliminated, like those people could sing too. So it was just such like a, like random spiral of events of I don't know, like I, this might work out. This might not work out. So you could just only do your best and then hope for the best.

Quincy: 16:37

I hope someday they release your

Pillow: 16:40

I don't like,

Quincy: 16:42

can have it and

Pillow: 16:43

what do they say? Like, when you wanna get someone outta jail, it's free this person. Yeah. Free, My rendition of

Quincy: 16:48

outta jail card.

Pillow: 16:49

free it. Honestly, I'll be real. There's I guess it was one of those things where it was like, like it all felt like all of it happened so fast. And so part of me, there's a part of me that's sad that they didn't show it, but there's also a part of me that was like, relieved that they didn't show it.'cause I don't, I remember when I did it, I was like, it was like a blur. So I couldn't tell you. I know I did a good job, but I couldn't tell you like. I didn't play the tape back I don't know. So it's just very much like I did my best girl and the lights were flashing, the cameras were cameraing. It was so wild. Like I felt like I was on like a Grammy stage or something. It was literally, because the cameras are like so big and they move around, it was like insane. So I took my moment, I shook my ass, I did my thing. I don't know why it didn't get shown, but I, in a weird way, like I know like God, makes things work for how they're supposed to. So I'm fully trusting that whatever was supposed to be shown was supposed to be shown. And they showed enough of me to get from the universe what I needed. So I, I felt very happy with like my edit. But yeah,

Quincy: 17:54

So were you allowed to tell like your mom or your aunt or your grandma's or whatever, that you had got eliminated, or did you have to keep all that quiet until it just launched? What was it? August, July something. It came out, right? The show

Pillow: 18:07

I, I have to remember what even ha. So it was pretty much like when I got eliminated, obviously, like I had to go home. And so I just like my parents I didn't, so basically like obviously there's certain things I can and cannot say. But basically like I just went home. Like I, my parents knew, like I was, I basically told them like, oh, I'm gone for an artistic opportunity, you know what I'm saying? So I wasn't very specific with them. I didn't tell them like what it was or what was happening, but they had a fair I basically was like, I could be gone for three months. I could be gone for a week. I don't really know. And so just when it ended, I went home and stuff. So my family's always been so supportive. I've been having I've had different artistic opportunities, so they were just like, okay, girl. Come home whenever you need to. So I just like I just like when it was over, and it ended a little earlier than I would've liked it to. I just I packed up one bag, two bucks, one me I just went home and it was like one of those things where I just like took some time at home was with my family. It was super fun. And like on, that's also the crazy part too, now that I'm thinking about it, is like I can just see how all of it happened for a very specific reason.'cause I remember when I got eliminated, and they don't show this obviously, but I was like, I was really sad girl, like I was sad and they I was on film, like reacting to being sad and they showed a couple people getting eliminated and it's tough. You're so close to your like, you're so close to your dream, you know what I'm saying? Because making it in one of those groups, like I can even see now on social media like they're doing so well. You're so close to something that's just gonna have the spotlight. And as an artist, like having opportunities like that, they don't always come to you like a lot. And so having a moment where like one of the biggest platforms of all time is gonna put you on TV and showcase you. That's not something an artist, like me would take like lightly. So it was like one of the craziest like plots was ever because I remember I didn't make it like as far and a part of me felt like, was it'cause I'm not good enough? What was it that just didn't like work? What was it? But then it was like one of the best things I feel like that could have ever happened to me because it really just reminded me like your whole life especially when you're as an artist, like I've had to learn growing up that like rejection, one is protection and two. Whatever's for you is for you. And whatever's not for you is not for you. And I went in there being open to being in a group and I was like, that would be so cool if that is for me. But I was always gonna stay pillow prints regardless of if I was in a group or if I wasn't in a group. I was always just gonna stay me and do my own thing. And that's how I've always been like, like, I grew up Jared Garner, I still go by Jay or Jared Garner in some spaces. It just depends like who it is. But I also like, like pillow is the person that I've built for myself and that's who I also am. Like I resonate with different names for myself, but pillow is probably one that I hold like closest to me because it's one that I've created for myself. And I think the show just showed me it showed me like low key you're that bitch because you don't need to fit in. You've never needed to. And also you getting rejected from this'cause you don't fit in literally goes with your brand of you're yourself. You stay true to who you are, regardless if people don't like it or not. Because and I'm sure you can relate to this, like I'm a queer person, so like I didn't, I came out the womb not fitting in. Okay. Like I've been not fitting in, I've been having people say, oh I don't want you in my group. Like even in like middle school kind. I've had that forever. So this is just another taste of I might not fit in and okay, that's great. That means I'm like my own thing. It means I'm special. It means that not everyone, I'm not. And I even remember I said in my confessional I'm not everyone's cup of tea. Like I'm not, and that's totally okay and it can hurt. Sometimes it can be a little aw, like I didn't get that. But it also is okay, that's beautiful. Keep doing your shit.'cause there are gonna be people who like appreciate you for it or people who. Relate to you that you're gonna inspire. And that just that's my little 2 cents from it is that I think it really showed me that like I'm my own thing and I don't have to fit in to still be a bad bitch and be successful and to inspire people and, shine. Yeah.

Quincy: 22:26

So when you chose your name pillow, I think a lot of queer people in this conversation are automatically gonna think that you're a total bottom, but is that what it means?

Pillow: 22:36

So I've actually, I think this is something too, just as a queer person and exploring my sexuality, it's definitely changed a lot. Like when I first chose, so the reason I went, okay, the reason I go by pillow prints is because I was, I remember I was trying to come up with my stage name and I was like. I was like, Ugh. Nothing's really I wanted to go by the name verse at first, like VERS like the position.'cause I love writing music. I was like, verse would be so cool.'cause it's like music verse, like song verse, but also it's gay. It's like the position, like that would be really cool. But then I actually after thinking about that name, I like, there's a gay bar that I work at called Verse, and I basically got asked to like, apply for that job there around the same time I was figuring out my name, I think. And so literally I was like, oh, absolutely not. I was like, I can't work space called verse and also go by verse. And I also just was like I wasn't in love with it. Like I liked the name, but it, something about it was like, that's really cool. But I just, I don't know, like I just, it wasn't the perfect fit. So like that. I think that was a name that was really competing for a while. I had some other names that I was really coming up with, but nothing was like sticking the right way. And I remember I had a friend who we would, she would call herself a pillow princess. And like she was the first person I ever heard say that shit. I was like, what the fuck is that? Like a pillow princess? And she explained it like how, she's when I'm in bed, like I like to be like pampered. I like to just like lie there, look pretty, like da dah. And I was like, wait a minute. I like, no, I like that too. But I. was like, I wait a damn minute. I resonate with that. And I don't say that to say, oh my gosh, like I'm lazy in bed. I just like to sit there. You know what I mean? But I was like, just that energy of sitting pretty. Feeling pampered, feeling loved. It's enough just to sit there and be there and like you're commanding the attention. And a bitch will bow down to you essentially and make you feel good and wanna arouse you and be like obsessed with you in the bedroom. That's what made me go, oh, I should take that and make it pillow prince. Make it masculine to fit me. And I feel like that's such like a campy fun. And it's also pillow. Princess is like a queer term, like it's a lesbian started term. And so I was like, I love that it has a queer history to it. I love that it's sexy, but it also sounds like like a pillow party, like a fun, like a pillow fight. Like it sounds fun, it sounds like quirky and so I just fell in love with that name. And then I also love like I literally have a crown like sitting on the wall. Like I love like royalty and I love I'm losing the word I love like luxury and I love just anything that has to do with like wealth and money and stuff like that. And I just feel like a rapper always has to have money and be rich and stuff like that. So I thought like the opulence of Prince with the fun, sexy campiness of a pillow combined really creates a world in which I can show multiple like facets of myself. So I, yeah, it will always be pillow, prints, it will also be pillow. I've also learned as I've gone further into it, something as I've been writing new music, like pillow just by itself. It was so funny'cause on the show they show it is pillow, but I usually like on Spotify, it's pillow prints. But even just going by pillow, like a lot of people call me pillow. I love that too because, I think sexuality has been something I've tried to figure out my whole life, like growing up. And so just, even just sexuality itself is like a huge part of my brand, A huge part of what I write about, a huge part of my music. But also what I love about pillow and what I've come to learn through writing music is I love writing about my dreams. I love writing about my fantasies. I love writing about what inspires me. And I imagine just when you go to sleep, like you say a wish at night or when you go to sleep, like you're in that dream world, you're in that fantasy. I feel like that's also what the name pillow like Prince to me means it's just like that dreamland of what I wanna be that dreamland of what I aspire to be, that like that dream of just like infinite possibilities. And so the name has really toggled with a ton of different aspects of who I am, whether it's like the sexual side, whether it's like the inspired side or the artistic side. Like it's literally. Been a huge part. But also to answer your question, I'm not a bottom. I would say I'm verse like I do everything. So that's thet. I love being a Philippine. There are moments where I like sitting there and my boyfriend loves that, so that's thet. But there are also moments too where I can like, I can be a top a lot too. That sounds so not confident, but like I have my moments, like sometimes the pillow prints, likes the pillow prints. Sometimes I like to be the one doing the work. I don't love to always just sit there, look pretty, but a lot of times I do. So I would say I'm

Quincy: 27:23

Yeah. That's fair. That's totally fair. I I am the same way. It depends on the person that I'm with. If they give really amazing top energy, then I'm happy to pillow

Pillow: 27:34

Like literally

Quincy: 27:35

But if they're like the, like very girly and dainty and don't really like, they're too pretty for me to think that they could even top me, then

Pillow: 27:44

exactly

Quincy: 27:45

Just let me have my way with you

Pillow: 27:47

If you beat me at my pillow princeness, then like you can be the pillow prince. There's always room for a pillow print. So I like, I totally relate. It's like such an who you're with thing. Like it really depends, so like I, I think that's why I love being versed because I feel like sexuality is so open and you can try so many different things that I personally don't just like to get locked down to one thing.

Quincy: 28:10

I I should ask some of my more mask friends. I've never asked them if they would ever even consider being topped by someone super femme or not. But before I go off topic, because there's so many things that I get say,

Pillow: 28:23

You should ask them that though. That's a good question. But some people don't like it. Like some people don't wanna be dominated. But I'm like very much like I get bored easily, so I'm like, let me switch it up. Like we gotta try different things. Like you gotta try different things.

Quincy: 28:36

But I do think once you get your first Grammy and they start wanting to have you like what do you call it? Endorse brands or something like that, or have your own line that one of the things you should absolutely do is have a line of sheets and pillows for

Pillow: 28:54

what I've been sent. So here's my journey. So I wanna be a billionaire, right? Let's get into it. In order for me to become a billionaire, part of my plan is to make my boyfriend a billionaire. So that's part of it is like I'm trying to work on him to get his stuff together because I believe in him to do that. But that's one of the, I know I'm gonna be a billionaire either way, whether my man's the billionaire, or whether I'm the billionaire. Hopefully it's me. But look, we have to invest in multiple aspects of our life to get to our goal. So I'm working on him right now, but I'm also working on me. And at the same time, I know that when I make it, I would love to do. I would love like, yeah, like a bedding line or like bedroom furniture line. I think that would be so cool. Like really cool. Just like bedroom furniture sheets, pillows, blankets, like whatever you name it. But I also would like a sex toy line too. Like just bedroom bed. I don't know what the word would be, but just like anything bedroom like, you're gonna come to the pillow store. Something like that. Like I would love that.

Quincy: 29:54

Oh my God, that is gonna be awesome. I'll definitely shop there. So have your your, what's the store called? The flagship

Pillow: 30:03

I, no, I wa it's going to, it's gonna be big. I don't know what it's gonna be called yet, but it's gonna be huge. Like it's going to,

Quincy: 30:10

it could be next door to the Restoration Hardware that's in West Hollywood. That's about the size of a small

Pillow: 30:15

that's what I'm saying I really would love, I would love to take over like bedroom couture. I think that would be, I think it would literally be everything, but it would be so fun. I would, and

Quincy: 30:25

and then on the bed is like the different harnesses and the different dildos and everything handcuffs, hanging, like on the beds, on the headboard and things like that. And you open the dresser and

Pillow: 30:37

like, literally oh my gosh. Yeah. We'll have to talk. I might need a business partner. Yeah. so I don't know, we're gonna sell everything. We're gonna sell plushies, we're gonna sell like mattresses, sheets, pillows. Then we'll have a sex, a sexual like lingerie line. Like I just wanna do every I think that'd be so really cool. Yeah. That's the thing too, is right now I feel like I'm doing kind of a rebrand. Like I'm really trying to figure out, just'cause with the show I've had a lot of new people find me and support me. And even just like you, like I've met you through the show and I'm so grateful that I've met so many cool people. And I just really want to figure out, just take a second and figure out like, what is my brand? Because I think there have been parts of me that have been so like all over the place I'm sexy, I'm fun, I'm campy, I'm this, I'm that. But I really want people to like. When they hear my name, I want them to think like something specifically. So I'm really trying to figure out like, what can I do to get my audience to focus in a little and understand like what my next era is or what I'm like here to offer or what's the vibe? Because I don't know, I just want I want as many people as possible to relate, but I also want, the real ones to like really get what I'm doing. So I just, a lot of thought goes into all my projects and stuff like that. So I'm really excited just for what's to come because just know that there's a lot of work and effort going into it.

Quincy: 31:56

So what's your favorite way to warm up your voice before you go on a show? Actually, you know what I should ask you first is what opportunities have come to you since being on the show? Because I can imagine that you come here to la, you film the show, you fly back to New York, you didn't get on the show, but you still made like a mini Grammy appearance, right? You got to film with great cameras, great scenery, backup dancers, like the whole, not backup dancers,

Pillow: 32:20

on the stage.

Quincy: 32:21

choreographers and vocal coaches and things like this. But then you come home and you can't say anything, and then all of a sudden the show hits and then things start hitting and you're just like, it's like a delayed reaction. Because you were good enough to get on, but you still had this letdown. But you're still, it's a one in 50 that you had a chance of going

Pillow: 32:42

that's what's crazy is yeah, like it was 50 of us out of like thousands of people got to go do the opportunity. So like even to get on was like insane. Like I basically, that's why I'm saying like, I feel like I won because I got to get on there in the first place. Like to even get on there was crazy. And I'll imagine I didn't come in there being like, oh, my name's Jared. No. I came in there oh my name's pillow. This is pillow prints. And I was true about like my self the whole entire time. Like I did not like. I did not play with that.'Cause they asked me like, do you wanna go buy Jared? And I was like, no. Like I don't, because to me, Jared is not the musician like Jared is who like, I would say Jared or Jay is who wakes up in the morning like brushes his teeth cooks some breakfast. But Jared or Jay or Jared or J is not the person on stage performing or the person on stage like representing the music. Like they're like two different people. And I explain that. I feel like sometimes I'm like Hannah Montana because like in my room I have two closets. Like I have a closet for like me when I'm not an artist and I'm not doing that stuff. And then I have a closet for like pillow. And pillow is like a whole separate person with different wants, needs, desires, like outfits. So

Quincy: 33:54

Yeah,

Pillow: 33:55

yeah.

Quincy: 33:56

what does regular Jared wear? Just outta curiosity.

Pillow: 33:59

me look. That's so funny. So I would say so pillow would wear something like this. Regular jade's a little more. I feel like for, this is a good example actually. This is a perfect example. Pillow would not wear this. This is just

Quincy: 34:17

I didn't even think that

Pillow: 34:18

Jared I feel like Jared's been hidden his more trade moment recently, but Jared still wears like crop tops and stuff like that, but like pillow is giving more like royalty, opulence, lingerie, sexy, femme, Glamor. Jared is giving more like hot gay, like cute gay, like c but more so yeah, like I still, Jared still wears like fun stuff. Like even if pillow was gonna wear something like this, pillow would judge it up. You know what I'm saying?

Quincy: 34:47

Okay.

Pillow: 34:47

JJ pillow, I just think has more outward fashion, more crazy stuff. Jared is just more, I would say, not reserved necessarily, but definitely more I don't know, casual, like casual cunty rather than campy cunty. It's very different. I,

Quincy: 35:02

So if each chapter feels like a costume and a shedding of skin, which identity do you feel is the hardest to leave behind? Sometimes. Do you feel like it's sometimes it's too much work to be pillow, or do you think that's your most natural state, or is your more natural state, Jared?

Pillow: 35:19

I think my more natural state is probably, yeah, like I would say my more natural state is like Jared, like for sure. Jared is who like is sitting at home like chilling, vibing, you know when I'm with my boyfriend, I'm Jared. Like one time I literally remember I was like, it's pillow. I told my boyfriend It's pillow prints to you. And he got like mad at me'cause he was like, but it was so cute'cause he was like, no, like I wanna love you for like you like I love pillow prints. But he was like, I wanna love you for you like and like I want to know the real you because I do think pillow prints, is it's hard for me'cause I don't wanna say pillow. Prints is a character'cause pillow, prints is who I am. But I think pillow prints is like me dialed to a hundred, like pillow prints is me dialed up to the per person of this is who pillow prints is. The version of me that I kept hidden growing up pillow princes is the version of me that was like told you can't be like that. You can't express this. So when pillow prints hits the stage or when pillow prints goes outside or when pillow prints does this stuff, it's like an unleashing of everything that was not allowed. Growing up. And so it's like my Sasha Fierce in a way. But the difference is, I feel like for example, like Beyonce goes on as Beyonce, but then she has her Sasha Fierce. When I go on I'm pillow prints I'm like literally like my artist self is pillow prints. So that's the the difference. So I would say the hardest I would say. How about this? I think to answer your question, I think it's sometimes the hardest to click into, I would say can be pillow prints because sometimes it's hard to always, I don't wanna say perform, but sometimes it can be hard to be confident or sometimes it can be hard to like really grasp who you are and just be limitless and to perform and to give in a certain way. So I think sometimes pillow Prince has turned into this thing for me where I want to do pillow print justice. Like I, I want to, I wanna really admit everything that I've, worked so hard on. And sometimes it can be a little hard, like if I'm going through it to always put on the country outfit, or if I'm not feeling it, or if I feel like, I don't know what's going on in my life, it can be sometimes hard to be the superhero or just turn into everything that I want to be or go after my goals, go after my dreams. And so my goal really is to I've even been saying it that I think pillow prints need to show up more. So in my everyday life, like I think obviously it is like a different entity, but it still is who I am. And there are aspects of pillow prints all the time. But I really do. I was even telling someone the other day that like, I wish that like when I go outside more just to go do stuff or go out with friends, like sometimes it's maybe I need to find better ways of integrating pillow prints into an everyday like thing for me so that it doesn't always feel like. It's oh, let me go in the closet and find pillow prince's stuff more so show pillow prints in every way you can all the time because he still is a huge part of you. And yeah, I know it's weird'cause it's like third person, but it's just it really is like an identity, but I feel like it's like I know when pillow prints is on and I know when Pillow Prince is off. And I think a huge thing for me since the show and just since everything is really clicking into it so people know like this is who I am. Like I'm not going away. Like I'm really going to make it and I'm destined for this. And you're gonna know who Pillow Prince is essentially late.

Quincy: 38:35

Yeah, for sure. Oh my gosh, I love that. So since the show too, has your boyfriend had any issues with jealousy or like people noticing you guys when you go out now? What, how has that transformed your relationship going from say, not quote unquote TV famous to being, TV

Pillow: 38:55

So my boyfriend is my biggest supporter. I have such a good circle of

Quincy: 39:00

love that.

Pillow: 39:01

my best friends are also supportive. I'll say this, like my boyfriend, like he is it's so funny. I don't wanna I'll literally say this, he is so funny. He helps, so he's into marketing and so he helps me all the time with figuring out how to market my brand. He helps me all the time, like when I need a video, film. Half those videos on my Instagram of me walking and like singing to the camera. He's the one recording it. He

Quincy: 39:24

I was gonna ask you

Pillow: 39:25

my boyfriend, he does the like he'll literally. And it's so fun for him. Like he enjoys it.'cause he loves art and stuff and he's not an artist himself, but he loves he loves being to be a, getting to be a part of it. He loves my music, he loves recording me. He also LOL. He also loves Like he literally bought me, our anniversary was a couple days ago and he bought me, it's called. Thank you. He bought me a Gimbal to record me so so the camera can follow me. Like he bought that for me'cause he like plans to do more videos with me and stuff like that for myself. So he's like my biggest fan. Like he's so supportive. We went to Fire Island together last week and I got noticed this pillow I don't know, at least I would say I got noticed this pillow at least 10 times while I was next to him. And he's

Quincy: 40:10

so cool. Good

Pillow: 40:11

gosh, like it's happening for you. He was like, that's crazy. He was like, you need to click in girl. Like he's he comes to everything. He's literally, I have a performance I have a perform like how you were asking about opportunities that have happened, like since this, I got asked to perform for a queer festival in Harrisburg, Pennsylvania called Outfest. It's happening September 20th. So really soon I'm doing a whole like 40 minute set and literally he is like driving me and my dancers up to the show. So he's like the best, like I could not ask for

Quincy: 40:41

Oh, wow.

Pillow: 40:42

Like more supportive, like just more uplifting for my career than him. And so he doesn't get jealous of anything. He's I'm so happy this is happening for you. So he's just been there every step

Quincy: 40:52

I

Pillow: 40:52

because I've dated him since the show, like since I was, before I was on the show, I was dating him. So like he's been like there for every step of the way. Yeah.

Quincy: 41:01

That's so cool. The thing I want you to tell him for me is that you can tell whoever was videoing you.'cause that was obviously, it's something that I was curious about, is the person that is filming you, which is him, that we know we love him. Did you wanna use his name?

Pillow: 41:16

His name's Curtis.

Quincy: 41:19

Curtis that Curtis knows your body, he knows your ankles, he knows what to look for when he's filming you. So it's on point. It's not just like a friend, right? That doesn't have the intimate knowledge of you and your best side and the way that you look and like the things to capture and the videos. Like when you're walking down the sidewalk and you're jumping off the fountain and you know the different things that you do. He knows your body. So he's getting those shots in a

Pillow: 41:45

gonna have to put him on my, I'm gonna have to start paying him sued because he is good. He is good. I literally don't know.'cause he's good. And he tries really hard and he does such a, like a good job and I can just tell he wants it to be good for me. And he like nev he will show up at the crack of dawn to support me and fill me and just help me do it. So he's really great.

Quincy: 42:06

I love that. I love that. Which song from your new album, which is called What You Wanna Tell Us? Slept on you guys. Is that not

Pillow: 42:15

It's really fierce. Like it's you guys, you can click into it. Click into it.

Quincy: 42:20

I have listened to a couple songs. In fact, we made a playlist in the car, my daughter and I, and it's called Podcast Guests because I want so many different singers to come on, and we just have this playlist just of you guys, different people of you guys singing. So she, we know some of your songs, but out of the songs on that album, which one feels like your most naked truth? The one where you almost didn't put it out to the world.

Pillow: 42:46

Ooh, that's a question. That is a I. Okay. I would probably say the most like naked one that like probably if you like read the lyrics is like the most oh my gosh. I would probably say it's back shot. Which is the first song? Yeah, it's the first song on the album. I don't remember if I didn't write that one first, but. It's the first song on the ep. It's and basically like I can say some of the lyrics it goes like, how are you gonna hit it from the back then leave. You never text me back. Try to put you in the back of my mind to forget. Deep down, I know you're never coming back, not a friend. And like the chorus is it was a back shot, not a real shot. I thought we had one, but I guess not. It was a back shot, not a real shot. Still wounded. And

Quincy: 43:36

Oh,

Pillow: 43:37

that was probably, that's like the saddest song I ever wrote. It's I love it though.'cause it starts off so sad and then the house kind of starts come, like the music starts going and it's probably one of my, the best songs I've ever written. And I think that one is just like showing the most to me because I wrote that at a really vulnerable time. Essentially what happened was this was before my boyfriend, like a year or two before I think. And. Like I, it was a time where I was like hooking up with a lot of people on Grindr and just like I was in the streets. Yeah.

Quincy: 44:07

old grinder.

Pillow: 44:09

it was like, I was in the streets, I was being crazy. I was doing a lot of things that I don't remember probably but it was a time and during that time, yeah I'm and I'm so thankful for that time'cause it taught me so much about sexuality and like what I like, what I don't like what I need. It was a beautiful time. But the thing, a beautiful, slightly traumatic and just very, a lot, I was just a lot it was, I was in the streets. And

Quincy: 44:36

yeah

Pillow: 44:37

that's so funny. I need to write a song called In the Streets. But yeah, I was in the Streets girl.

Quincy: 44:42

do.

Pillow: 44:42

A lot of random apartments, a lot of places that I shouldn't have been and a lot of great memories. But the thing is essentially I wrote it because I had this guy come over and. Essentially what happened was he came over, it was supposed to just be like a regular hookup. Like it was supposed to be just a we were just gonna get to it. But he came over and then, and I didn't know him, like I met him on Grindr so he like, just showed up to my house and he was like, so handsome, like very beautiful man. And I remember he came over and he starts talking to me and he starts like asking me about what I like to do in the city and just essentially wanting to get to know me, and he's I have a cat. So he picks up my cat it's so cute da dah. And it goes from I expected this man to come over and we were just gonna fuck basically, and just let him leave. I thought that was what was gonna happen is that it was gonna be just a quick, like sexy hookup. But basically he like hung out with me. Like we had a good moment. Like it was really good. It was just, we were talking and I was like, oh. This might be more than just like a hookup, right? Like I, I was like, I feel like I could really be like, I don't know, like more than just like a hookup to this man. I don't know, I could just tell there was that instant connection. There was that instant just like feeling of arousal and he just came over and we had a really good time. And then literally, I remember he like went to the bathroom for a minute or two, then he came back and then we started like making out or something. And then he was like, you know what? I think I have to go. And I was like, I know, it gagged me. Like it was messed up. I was like, what? Like I was literally like, you have to go. What do you

Quincy: 46:18

Oh my God.

Pillow: 46:19

And he was like, I just I don't remember what, and this was a while ago, so I don't remember exactly what he said, but he was like, I just have to go. I think you seem really cool and I just feel like we could be really good friends and I don't wanna fuck this up, so I'm just gonna go I don't think we should hook up or some shit. That's literally what happened. And so he left and I remember I just was so sick and tired of like men at the time because I was, even though I was hooking up a lot, I was still looking for someone to fall in love with. Like I want, I had been going on dates, like I was actively like searching for a partner, right? So keep in mind all of a sudden this beautiful, and he was like, literally like the thing about him is I think it felt like a lot of cards made sense for him. Like he was also like a person of color and that was something I was really valuing or really do value is like I at the time, like it just in where I was like, I feel like he just really stuck out as someone that would've made sense for me and just I was just attracted to him in a certain way. And I remember he left and I was like. Hurt.'cause I was like not me showing who I really am, like not me showing, like I read his tarot cards, which is also a lyric in this song. Like I read your tarot cards. I guess I wasn't in your future. Like I like read his tarot cards. Like it was like a date essentially. And then it just flopped at the end.'cause he just was like, I have to go. And I remember I just was like, that's actually crazy. Like I show my whole self to you. I read your tarot cards, like I fully got into it with you. I showed like the love I showed my personality because sometimes on hookups you don't talk a lot. They just come over, you're hot, they're into you. It happens. You never see them again and it's over. But with him it was like, I'm like really vibing with you. I'm showing you my personality that I don't usually show to everybody. Like I'm really like giving you access to that. And then the moment I show you all of that, you're not interested in me anymore. It that's what it felt like. And we did end up actually becoming. Best friends, or, it's funny how it worked out, but we became really good friends later on. But the thing is and I'm grateful that we did, but at the time it was really hurtful to me and it's not his fault. Like it's totally valid to be like, I want to go, like whatever. But at the time, like it just felt like my heart broke a little because I'm like, here I am looking For people to fall in love with and stuff. And it just feels every time I show my personality, every time I get to that second, third day, every time they see who I am, they don't, they're not attracted to me anymore or they're not into me anymore, or they, and so it feels like men just like me for my body and like what I look like, but they don't necessarily like me for like my personality. And so that's what that felt like.

Quincy: 48:58

But you have such a beautiful personality, like you and I chatted online, then we took a phone call and now we're having this in person, and you just become more and more endearing the more that I talked to you. So I don't think that they gave it enough time, and I'm glad that you're friends with this person now, but did you guys like resolve, like why did he actually say he wanted to leave? Because

Pillow: 49:21

not, unfortunately we're not friends anymore and that's like for a whole different reason. But like we were friends for two years, like a long time. Like we were like really close friends for a long time, essentially. Like I later found on, there were reasons as to why they did not, it had nothing really to do with me. It had to do with something else that was going on and they just didn't wanna entangle me into that. That's how specific I'll get. But essentially like they just were not in a place where they could handle that emotional connection. And I think they saw that with me and so they pushed it away instead of like I think they saw that and they saw that I was like a good person or whatever. I don't know. They like saw that, I was someone they could actually build a friendship with. Or relationship with, and they just were not ready for that in that moment. So essentially, they didn't wanna just fuck me and treat me like everybody else, which I think is actually a really kind thing that they did because they didn't wanna hurt me. But at the time it did not feel like I didn't know that. So later on it resolved and I learned more about why it went from being so like that to then being like instantly like that. But it just, it was, and that's something I've learned too, is it's like someone rejecting you or someone not wanting you, you don't have, it's not your business to know why someone's not interested in you or why someone doesn't wanna be like, that has nothing to do with you. Don't internalize that, but at the moment I was like, I don't know, I was like 22. Like I was just always thinking there was something wrong with me or there was something that I could do better or I don't know. I was like in person, am I not cute enough? Like I thought it was my fault. And so literally he left and I wrote that song and it was just like,

Quincy: 50:58

Oh,

Pillow: 50:58

back shot, not a real shot. So like I, it was just about sex to you. And the moment it became more than sex to you or more than just like the physical, what I look like, there was no chance, like you just had you didn't want me essentially once you saw the real me, and there's one lyric too that's I just wanted you to see the genuine me, but all you ever cared about was being in me. And that lyric wasn't even just specifically about him, but just, it just was about gay men in general where it was like, you guys just want to fuck, but you don't want. To actually like connect and love and treat me like, like you don't want that. And it was heartbreaking. So I think that's probably the song that like really exposes like the true reality of how it sometimes feels to hook up with people as a man or a woman, or even just like in general, like it can feel like people value you for not all of you, but just for I guess what they can get from you or just more so for the surface level stuff.

Quincy: 51:56

Wow. I wasn't even sure where that question was gonna go, but that was an amazing answer to that and it makes me feel so sad for you, but I'm glad that it probably also gave you that one. It gave you amazing lyrics to a song that I think should probably be the number one song this week. Because knowing the backstory and tear the song really like it hits home for everybody. There's not one person on this planet that's been in love with somebody that, or even just had an attraction to somebody that wasn't kicked in the ass and fell on their face basically. That's a, that's like really deep. What other types of personal experiences do you usually use? Like when you write your music or is it sometimes just this has nothing to do with me. I've never thought of it, but it sounds like it might be a good song

Pillow: 52:48

so I usually, I definitely feel like my first project, like I love, like I'll, basically, the way I write music is I usually come up with a title for a song first. So I wrote a song about like pegging, right? It's called Peggy Sue. I was like, I wanna write a song about pegging. Then I was like I should probably write a song about someone who is like doing the pegging. So I was like, what could be like a fun way to make a song about someone? And I came up with the name Peggy Sue, and I was like, you know what? Let me write this song about this girl named Peggy Sue, who's

Quincy: 53:21

can you, for our audience that does not know, because I'm sure we have some allies on here that still might not know what pegging is. Can you tell them what it

Pillow: 53:28

is? essentially when a female, or I guess we could also just say a female presenting person. Basically she is the one doing the fucking to the man. So I get what I've learned too is like pegging essentially like a girl could put on a strap on and she could fuck her boyfriend or her male partner like that. That is a form of pegging, that's the most traditional form of pegging. So it's when a woman fucks the man essentially. And I basically had a conversation with one of my, one of my really good friends about his, him and his girlfriend. And he was saying that she pegs him. And I was so intrigued by that. And then I started just being like, you know what, like more men should, even straight men should let women like peg them because gay or not, you still have a G-spot back there. You still have and I've been really, that's been something on my mind for a long time is like all these straight men are out here. Some of'em know and they probably are like down low, but a lot of men out here are like neglecting their G-spot. And I just think that's really sad and its just it feels good. And it's not even like with a woman, I feel like a lot of men are like, oh that's so gay. But it's with a woman it wouldn't be gay. And two, like you can be stimulated down there. It doesn't even have to be the whole like process of a strap on or anything, but like men should be open to women like fingering them or men should be open to women like. We're eating them out and stuff like that. Like men should be open to that because it is stimulating, you know what I'm saying? But it's so sad that like homophobia and just like toxic masculinity makes men not want to take part. Essentially. I'm like, the gays are onto something. There's a reason there's so many bottoms out here. Okay. Because it feels good. It feels good, and so that's my whole thing. And so I wanted to write a song that glorified men being one

Quincy: 55:17

The glorified the glory

Pillow: 55:18

glorified, like that really glorified men being dominated by women and letting women be dominant in that kind of, and just I really wanted to just talk about that because I just don't think there's enough songs about women being the dominant one towards the man in the bedroom. And I just thought that would be such an interesting story to tell. And I really wanted it. I don't know. I really, I think that song really is for women to know, like how sexy it can be to dominate a man, but it's also for men to feel confident and comfortable to let a bad bitch. Peg them. So it's just for everybody. It's for everybody.

Quincy: 55:53

Sing a couple lines.

Pillow: 55:54

Ooh, what should I do? My favorite verse. Okay. Lemme see. Let go. Okay. Okay. I like this one. Her name is Peggy. She asked me, nigga Izzy, ready? I'm no bitch. I said, I'm steady girl. Popped at Alex and confetti big like Yeti, no de or no need to beg me. I'm gonna let my girl through leg me. She a hot girl. She go beg me. I let her peg me. And then like I go further to tell the story.'cause I go, Peggy put it down on me. I said, girl, take it. So that's how it's gonna have to be. She opened up my legs, get me shit out like a v Peggy out here fighting te masculinity. She say, and then I just keep going and I like tell this.

Quincy: 56:28

my

Pillow: 56:29

Yeah, like I tell this story about there's a woman just like showing up and wanting to dominate me. And I just think like whether. Like whether you're the man, whether you're the woman, I think is a song that more people should listen to and can relate to. And I think it's fun. And I just think sexuality should always be fun and you should always be open to trying new things. And honestly, the world would be a better place if men let women dominate them. So that's, I'll stand on that.

Quincy: 56:53

I actually took my best friend to a sex shop. This was years ago now, and we were probably buzzed, who knows, but we probably were. And this was in Laguna Beach. And we went into the sex shop and I said, oh my God, you gotta get a little dildo and you gotta fuck your husband in

Pillow: 57:12

Like literally.

Quincy: 57:13

it. And she's what do you mean? And I'm like, dude, just let's go look at like the skinnier ones, like the small ones. And I said, you're not gonna need like a strap on or whatever. You can literally just, lube it up and stick it up his ass and make sure we're getting like a curved one, or whatever. So she's okay yeah, I wanna do it. I wanna do it. So we bought that and a bunch of other things. He ended up not admitting that he liked it, maybe he uses it

Pillow: 57:34

I bet you he DI bet you or I bet you he already did use it and literally just had to pretend like he doesn't because I just don't believe that. I don't believe that it didn't feel good. Like I believe that it wouldn't feel good at first. Like I believe that at first it would be kinda like, Ooh, I don't know about that. But at least I will give him points for trying. I think being open-minded. There's also gay people who don't like bottoming, like it's not like an inherently, but I just feel like so many men neglect and it's also just not even about just pegging. It's about letting a women like women lead, letting a woman not always be the submissive one. That's what it's about. And just being open to that. And I know there's a lot of people who are, but like I decided it's a great song to like turn sexuality over and be like, okay, maybe change the roles up sometimes. Like it's fun to experiment, it's fun to be playful and it's. It's just fun to, do things that you haven't tried before.'cause it's about in the song, it's about like pillow prints getting pegged for the first time, and it's pillow prints has never been pegged. So it's being open to something new, something refreshing. Yeah,

Quincy: 58:38

Yeah. Have you been

Pillow: 58:39

so I've never been pegged by a woman but I have been like, the closest to being pegged by a woman would be, I got, I have been like fucked by a trans woman before, which was so fun and so hot. I've never, I guess I've never been PE so I actually have this, I actually have been with women before, but I actually have I've been with like everybody, but the thing is with a woman specifically,

Quincy: 59:02

Good for you.

Pillow: 59:03

pegged me, but I'm obviously so open to that, into that. I've I've had a, a dildo in me before. It's just never been because a woman was like doing it. So I essentially like.

Quincy: 59:15

yeah.

Pillow: 59:16

I just think like you should just be open to different things. And I'm like very I I, I've consider myself like pansexual, like I could be intimate with anybody that I'm attracted to. So I don't really I have no preference to like, not peg, get pegged. I I've basically done a lot, so like I'm fully for it. I'm fully for trying new things. Like I'm so into that. Like I just think you have to play around and figure out what's right for you.

Quincy: 59:42

Definitely because you don't know what you're gonna and again, it goes back to, it depends on the partner you're with, that you're with. Like some partners can do like crazy things to me and other ones I'm just like, no that's too much. Like I don't enjoy that from you or whatever. But we're gonna go back to Netflix again. Did you watch The

Pillow: 59:59

No, I don't know what that is.

Quincy: 1:00:01

Okay. The Hunting Wives is a new show that came out and it's, it has a lot of lesbians scenes in it. Unfortunately, the two characters that play it aren't actually lesbians that are the main characters. But one of the co-stars is married to this sheriff of the town, and this is in Texas, and she's pegging him in

Pillow: 1:00:21

That's so hot.

Quincy: 1:00:22

of the Second to the last episode. So if you don't watch anything else, go to the second to the, I think there's eight episodes. Go to episode seven. Don't get me wrong. You could get me wrong because it could be episode eight, but it's either seven or eight and she's pegging him. And it is mind boggling that even Netflix was allowed to show this because it's very clear that she's fucking pegging him and they're laying on their side and she has on a t-shirt he doesn't have on a shirt. But of course the sheet is over them so you can't see anything. But it was a really hot scene. It really was. And the fact that he's a sheriff and then the next scene after they're like breathless and everything, he like storms into the like stronger than ever, like more masculine, ever strong, storms into the sheriff's station, we're gonna catch this. Killer motherfuckers.

Pillow: 1:01:11

Okay. Maybe I need to watch this. That thing. They should have used my song. That would've been so good, but that's what I'm saying yeah. I think it's so fun to change it up like. And just be open to things because I think people who get so stuck in their ways like that, they don't want to try stuff. And I, I just feel like you, you need to experiment. Like you need to try different things. I'm like, that's the, I think that's the thing is even though I say I was in the streets doing crazy stuff, that time was a huge playground. That time was a huge time for me to experiment and learn what I liked. Like I don't think even though I would say I'm not as sexually active, like I have a boyfriend, so we're like, obviously very sexually active, but I'm not necessarily I used to always be sleeping with a lot of different people. Like I'm monogamous with my boyfriend, so it's very different. But I'm appreciative that I've learned so much about what I like sexually from different people so that I can bring that to the conversation with my partner. You know what I mean? And so I would always say be open, even if you're just with one person. Be open to trying new things with them. There's a lot of fun stuff you can do out there. And that's what I love about my music is so much of it is about like just, just like playing around and just learning from different sexual experiences and stuff.

Quincy: 1:02:18

I have loved our conversation. We are going to wrap it up soon because we've hit our mark, but I wanted to say, if love had a sound in your life right this very minute, what would it be? Is it more velvet? Is it more staticky? Is it like gospely? What is that sound in your life right now?

Pillow: 1:02:42

Oh my gosh, that's such a good question. Like how did you come up with that? That's like such a hard, like I could literally say it for an hour and Okay. You know how I'm gonna describe it to me

Quincy: 1:02:53

Do

Pillow: 1:02:54

if I'm like thinking about how my life feels like in love and just like how I'm feeling. Have you ever been to a rave before? Okay. Per, let's get into it. So imagine you're at the rave. You've been listening to the music all day, like it's, or all night or whatever, and it's been like blasting so loud so that by the time the party's over, let's pretend you were not wearing the ear protection that you should have been wearing. Your ears are just like

Quincy: 1:03:20

Okay.

Pillow: 1:03:20

out. And then let's pretend you're like, oh fuck. Like I have my ear protection in my pockets. I should probably put that in. I feel like now we're at the point where you've, so like you're, you can't hear that well'cause it's like loud and then you just put these like ear, like noise things in and it's like the last song the DJ plays so I go to like horse meet disco a lot and a lot of times at the end of horse meet disco, they're playing like very classic like house music or very sorry, very classic like disco music. I feel like it's like a. Like a faint like disco sound that you can just hear in the back of your ears with a slightly muffled, like beautiful like vibe over it. That's how, if that makes any sense. But like essentially that reminds me of the love I'm going through right now. Because I don't feel like I feel like love can sometimes be so loud, but once you get a little used to it, it can have this kind of this muted feeling and this warmth to it. And I feel like that's how I would explain it. With my boyfriend, like we go out a lot and when we go out a lot, we stay at the rave the whole time. But I always love those moments like where we go out and we're dancing the whole time and then by the end it's like the last song it's like the DJ's choice and like it's like slower. And then I feel like that's a real moment to Celebrate the love with each other and like really appreciate the time that you've had. And so that kind of muffled like always present like pretty sound is probably how I would explain like how I feel with love right now. Like it's just a always there, always warm, always present, not always loud and in your face like that, but it's like you have that energy lifting you like faintly through and floating. So that's probably what I would say.

Quincy: 1:04:55

That's so pretty. I love it. Thank you so incredibly much for coming on the show and I can't wait to follow your career and have you on again for you to tell us what's happening next and all that kind of stuff. But I love you. I love your show. I love everything about you. I love your relationship and I hope that you guys have a great time. You stay on with me now'cause I just have to let it upload. Is that okay? Okay. Just for.